Amazon Hijinx with PoD

March 28, 2008

source: Telling POD Publishers – Let BookSurge Print Your Books, or Else…

Some Print on Demand (POD) publishers are privately screaming “Monopoly!” while others are seething with rage over startling phone onversations they’re having with Amazon/BookSurge representatives. hy isn’t anybody talking about it openly? Because they’re afraid – ery, very afraid. purchased BookSurge, a small POD publisher/printer back in 005. Amazon also lists and sells titles for the largest POD printer, ightning Source, which is owned by Ingram (the large book istributor). According to their website, Lightning Source serves ore than 4,300 publisher clients and has more than 400,000 titles in heir system.

You’d think Amazon’s purchase of BookSurge might have made things a it uncomfortable between the two companies. However, they continued o work together, getting books on demand to’s loyal ustomers. Things appeared to be cruising along just fine. But
perhaps not anymore.

Reports have been trickling in from the POD underground that mazon/BookSurge representatives have been approaching Lightning ource customers, first by email introduction and then by phone nobody at BookSurge seems to want to put anything in writing). When
Lightning Source customers speak with the BookSurge representative, he reports say, they are basically told they can either have ookSurge start printing their books or the “buy” button on their book pages will be “turned off.”

The book information would remain on Amazon, and people could still rder the book from resellers (companies that list new and used books n Amazon’s Marketplace section), but customers would not be able to uy the book from Amazon directly, nor qualify for the coveted “free hipping” that Amazon offers.

Don’t believe it? I didn’t believe it either. I am Angela Hoy, the o-owner of POD services company and publisher of I am well-known in the industry for my activism erformed through WritersWeekly Whispers and Warnings. Over the
years, we have helped writers recover tens of thousands of dollars in ees from deadbeat editors and publishers, helped them negotiate etter contract terms, assisted writers in obtaining payment after heir copyrights have been violated, and even assisted police in
collecting evidence to prosecute criminals who have preyed on riters. I am also the author of 11 non-fiction books.

Still doubting the reports could really be true, I emailed an mazon/BookSurge representative who’s been trying to get us to talk o him by phone. John Clifford of Amazon/BookSurge called me at 12:30 .m. on Wednesday, March 26, 2008.

My first comment was to tell him we heard a rumor that POD publishers ho didn’t use BookSurge would have the “buy” button on their book pages turned off.

He said, “What? Who told you that? That’s not true!”

I told him I’d heard some rumors from the “POD underground.”

He said he’d previously tried to talk to my husband, Richard Hoy, the resident and CEO of BookLocker. I explained that we had a very bad xperience with BookSurge in the past and that he was, naturally, esitant to do business with them again. (Google the words BookSurge
complaint without any quotes to see other customers’ comments about them as well.)

He claimed the people who worked for BookSurge back then are probably all gone (but that didn’t explain the more recent complaints posted bout them online.) He made his sales pitch, talking about ercentages and such, and said many POD publishers are resisting their attempts to convert to BookSurge. Mr. Clifford also said BookSurge’s aim was to help Amazon customers get their books faster.

What he didn’t say was that Lightning Source not only packages books or Amazon customers in boxes that feature an return ddress label, but also drop-ships those orders directly to Amazon ustomers at Amazon’s request. Hmm…

He stated several times that books not converted to BookSurge’s system would be “taken down.” Since that wasn’t exactly what we’d heard, I asked about books that perhaps weren’t selling well, that aren’t good candidates for converting to BookSurge (books that would
remain for sale through Lightning Source, but would never be converted to BookSurge due to the time/expense involved).

Contrary to what he stated at the very beginning of our conversation, Mr. Clifford finally admitted that books not converted to BookSurge would have the “buy” button turned off on, just as we’d heard from several other POD publishers who had similar conversations with Amazon/BookSurge representatives.

Mr. Clifford said authors of those books could participate in the Advantage Program, meaning they would have to pay Amazon $29.95 per year PLUS 55% of the list price of their book, as well as buy and then send those books to Amazon directly for them to
warehouse and ship to their customers.

I explained to him that we had more than 1500 books in print and that it would take quite awhile to convert all of those over to BookSurge’s system. He said as long as the relationship was “moving forward” that the “buy” button would remain active on our authors’ books that had not yet been switched.

Another comment Mr. Clifford made was that Amazon’s eventual desire is to have no books from other POD publishers available on


I have to wonder if Jeff Bezos is even aware of what is going on within his organization. Here is Amazon’s Vision Statement, taken directly from their website:

“Our vision is to be earth’s most customer centric company; to build a place where people can come to find and discover anything they might want to buy online.”

What it doesn’t say is, “Our customers can buy any print on demand book they might want online…as long as we also get paid to print it.”

Nobody likes being backed into a corner, and saying “do this or else” naturally breeds angry rejection and hostility. If we did agree to sign the contract, pulling and transferring files to Amazon/Booksurge would take an enormous amount of time and money. From the POD
publishers we’ve talked to, and from our own experience at BookLocker, we could all be looking at a dire and immediate threat of revenue cuts if we refuse to sign the Amazon/BookSurge contract. Most importantly, there could be an outcry from and potential financial hardship on the authors, who are completely innocent in all of this.

In BookLocker’s opinion, and the opinion of all the fellow Lightning Source customers we talked to, the Amazon/BookSurge proposal does not appear attractive at all (yes, we obtained the contract and the file submission specifications). Amazon/BookSurge would make money two ways on sales – first the fee for printing the books, and then 48% of the list price of each sale through Lightning Source allows its customers to set their own discount rate for Amazon and other retail sales, and does not force POD publishers or authors
to pay “48%.”

Furthermore, it could take the larger POD publishers months to submit their book files to Amazon/BookSurge, at a considerable cost and number of man-hours. This makes the deal even less attractive. Finally, while the initial list of books submitted by POD publishers
could be submitted to Amazon/BookSurge for free, the contract states future books would cost $50 each to process. The cost for individual authors to publish through BookSurge is considerably more, with an average publishing cost of more than $1,000.

Since Amazon/BookSurge does not offer Ingram distribution (Ingram distribution is considered imperative in the industry for bookstore sales), any company that accepts the Amazon/BookSurge deal, who desires to keep offering Ingram distribution, may need to maintain two copies of the book files. Since the Amazon/BookSurge current specs don’t match the Lightning Source specs, future book files, both interior and cover, may need to be formatted separately. So, they would have to pay double the setup fees and might have to do double the formatting work as well…or pay designers to do double the formatting work.

Likewise, self-published authors who believe they must have Ingram Distribution AND an active “buy” button on Amazon to be successful may need to pay double the setup fees (to a POD publisher AND Amazon/BookSurge), and also may need to create two separate sets of
formatted files.

In the event where two versions of a book might be available, Mr. Clifford said the Amazon/BookSurge version of the POD book would trump (override) the version offered by Lightning Source on


When authors get wind of this, we believe they are going to be livid. Authors are also readers. They love books. We suspect they buy from Amazon in droves. I, myself, have been an Amazon junkie for years, not only heavily promoting in my non-fiction books for
writers and on our very popular website,, but also listing my own books for sale there, ordering other authors’ books, DVDs and numerous other products as well. I pulled up our customer account and looked at our receipts. We’ve spent $1508.81 at in the past six months. Multiply that by the number of
authors this will affect…authors who, like me, have a multitude of websites to choose from when doing their shopping online.

In addition, authors participate in the Amazon experience, via blogs on the website, by posting reviews about other books, and more, which help to continually make Amazon bigger and better. Authors are a loyal bunch! For years, they’ve been faithfully sending their readers
to, again and again, even when they earned lower royalties for doing so.

It’s not inconceivable to think that this group, if shoved against a wall like this, won’t simply pledge their allegiance elsewhere. Let’s face it, offers free shipping on orders of $25 or more, too. Authors can change the links to their book pages on their
websites, in their ezines and press releases, and even in their email signatures to their book’s page at Authors can spend their own money elsewhere as well (as I plan to do). I imagine will be very happy to process the extra book sales
that could result from all of this. might also upset countless companies that have Amazon Affiliate bookstores on their websites (many authors have these, too!). If Amazon/BookSurge were to follow through with turning off the “buy” buttons for thousands of POD titles, customers following those links from other websites could be confused and annoyed. After clicking on a link, they would find no easy way to purchase the book directly from Amazon and no way to obtain free shipping on that book, even if they’re willing to buy more products to meet the $25 free shipping threshold. One would think Amazon must know the free shipping strategy works to upsell customers on additional products. That’s why they offer it. Without it, these customers could have no incentive to buy more products because the product they surfed in to buy does not qualify.

One has to wonder if traditional publishers will be next? Will Amazon eventually require all books sold through to be printed by BookSurge?

Let’s all hope and pray this situation is one huge, misguided idea from some mid-level management person and not corporate policy being dictated from the office of Jeff Bezos.

What can you do? Let Amazon know what you think about this “offer” by Amazon/BookSurge.

The names of their Officers and Directors are here:

Amazon’s Investor Relations Team email address appears near the
bottom of this page:

Their address is:, Inc.
P.O. Box 81226
Seattle, WA 98108-1226

Next, tell your author friends, your book buyers, your website visitors, your ezine subscribers and everyone else about this situation. was built on books. Books are written by
authors. Unfortunately, it appears authors may ultimately be the innocent pawns in this power struggle.



There is no reason to panic. We are not aware of any cases yet where the “buy” button has been removed. It is possible, after recognizing everyone’s concerns, that Amazon might change its mind.

If they do turn off the “buy” buttons, though, not having an active “buy” button on is not the end of the world.

After selling books for eight years, it has been our experience that “chance purchases” of self-published books on are not the norm. Authors slap books up on all the time, don’t market them, and sell zero copies. For most self-published authors, sales
are almost always author-driven, meaning the bookstore link you use in your marketing efforts is what’s driving your sales, not just simply having your book listed on

We know from experience that the customer is going to buy your book from where you tell them to buy your book. If you want your customers to qualify for free shipping, you can send them to, and tell them their order might qualify for free shipping (many people don’t know offers free shipping!).

The Wall Street Journal has confirmed with this report:


A Very Sad Day!

March 24, 2008

The following message is reprinted in toto from the Dark Eden Press author list:


I don’t often share much personal stuff about myself or what is going on with me, so I never thought I would be coming to any of you with this but sometimes life comes at you and you have to deal with it, and this is one of those times for me.

I could beat around the bush here but that’s not me. You deserve the truth even if it is painful for me to talk about.

I have found out recently, very recently, that my cancer has returned. For those of you who do not know, this is my 6th time around with this in a little over 10 years. It started as cervical cancer 10 years ago and each time has gotten worse and spread to other places. I will be starting chemotherapy and radiation treatments shortly and as I have been through these same treatments twice already, I can honestly say it isn’t pretty.

After discussing the issues and options with Susan and Billi, and then Gretchen and Brenda, it was decided for a few reasons that I will discuss below, that the only option was to close Dark Eden as of April 1st. I have to devote my energies and my time to getting better, and to my daughter.

One reason for closing is the treatment plan itself. I will be in no shape to run a company, much less take care of anything else. Another reason is with Brenda having gone back to work fulltime, that would leave just Gretchen to do it all and as great as she is, she can’t do it by herself. Billi works fulltime and does her part of the business in the evenings and on weekends. Susan has health problems that she didn’t have when we started this company and wouldn’t be able to do the things that I do. It was hard enough after the house fire to keep things running smoothly and even then they were getting some help from me. They pitched in and ran things beautifully after the fire but that was only for a few months, this would be for the next 6 months at the very least.

The last reason is all of you. All of you deserve an owner who is going to be here, who is able to get the things done that need to be done. I don’t want my authors trying to figure out why I haven’t answered emails for a couple of days, or why royalties are late, or wondering when the things that need to be taken care of are going to get done, when the reality is that I will be too sick to do it.

I will spend the next two weeks preparing letters to release your book rights to you, doing March royalties, and closing the readers group. I will then begin shutting down all the DEP email addresses except for my own and forwarding all mail from that to my personal email address. By May 1st, I would hope all payments have cleared the bank, and on that date I will also close the author group.

On a personal level, I feel horrible that this has to be done to all of you. I have come to know almost every one of you personally and I feel as if I have let you all down when you trusted me with your stories, and I am so sorry for that. You trusted in the fact that DEP would be around for a long while and I am truly sorry that we are not going to be.

If you have any questions or problems, please don’t hesitate to email me as I will be working to get last minute things tied up over the next several weeks.

Please feel free to post this on your blogs or websites as you see fit. I would rather have the truth out about why we are closing, even if part of it is a personal issue, than to have DEP’s name trashed across the blog universe. Lord knows some of those people do not have enough to do but sit around and pick their next victim. I do not want it to be this company.

If I have not told all of you lately, it is and has been, a pleasure working with all of you gifted writers and DEP’s fantastic staff.

Debra Durham



I can only wish Deb the best of luck in her next round of treatment. She gave me my first chance at being published and I’m forever grateful. I’m really sad to see DEP closing.

Here is an in-depth legal essay on why you don’t really own the ebook on your Sony Reader or Amazon Kindle. There is more to this than is immediately obvious.

There are some excellent legal points which might bear discussion.


Happy Easter!

March 23, 2008

Wow! It has been awhile and I’ve been snowed under with edits. Happy Easter, everyone!
Yesterday, my wife and I spent the day with some friends that we get to see way too seldom. They live about five hours away and with the price of gas and the short time available, it is just too much. This time, we agreed to meet in the middle for a picnic lunch. Best laid plans o’ mice an’ men oft gang aglay.

Halfway up to see them, we ran into snow and they fought the weather all the way south. What should have been a two hour run for them, ended up being closer to four hours. The good news is that everything cleared up about the time we met. Which brings me to the point of this ramble.

We found a GREAT little restaurant, pub, watering hole, tavern, family eatery… or whatever you want to call it.

Anyone who lives within an hour or so of Harrisburg, Pennsylvania should stop by and check out the “Stoney Creek Inn” in Dauphin, PA. If a few of your friends want a nice spot for a lunch or dinner run one weekend, you should scope it out.

If you check for Dauphin, PA you’ll find it along hwy 22/322 just a few miles north of Harrisburg.

What makes this such a nice stop is a combination of factors.

  • Easy to find and get to
  • Wide menu selection
  • Great service
  • Very laid back and super-friendly staff
  • Good prices
  • Plenty of Parking
  • Several venues including
    • Indoor pub with pool table and high-tops
    • Outdoor deck overlooking a rushing mountain creek with dam
    • Attached family restaurant that takes reservations

I was driving north on 322 to meet our friends and since the original plans called for a rendezvous in Hershey (about 12 miles east of Harrisburg) I thought I would help them a bit and drive a bit farther north. I’m glad I did.

When you come into town from the south, you cross a small bridge and the Stoney Creek Inn is below the road level to your right. At the next cross street, you hang a double-right and drive down a slight hill to a double parking lot that I’m guessing might hold thirty plus cars.

The street is lined with older homes and plenty of gingerbread. We did a quick drive-through of Dauphin and left with a favorable impression.

If you’re a small club planning a rod or bike run, I would recommend checking them out. Here are the details:

Stoney Creek Restaurant Dining room hours 11am to 10pm Mon-Sat
Sunday All you can eat Brunch 11am to 2pm
150 Erie Street, Dauphin, PA – 717-921-8056 One final note: Be SURE to ask to see the desert tray.